Difference between revisions of "Talk:File system search"

From ArchWiki
Jump to navigation Jump to search
(Move to upstream)
(Move to upstream: re)
Line 27: Line 27:
 
:::::::::Nah for sure that list shouldn't stay in a separate page, at most it should be moved back to List of applications. However I'm starting to like it here, because it also helps keep the article as a generic presentation of search tools, without going too much into details that are already covered upstream. Anybody else thinks that "File system search" is a better title? -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 12:54, 18 November 2014 (UTC)
 
:::::::::Nah for sure that list shouldn't stay in a separate page, at most it should be moved back to List of applications. However I'm starting to like it here, because it also helps keep the article as a generic presentation of search tools, without going too much into details that are already covered upstream. Anybody else thinks that "File system search" is a better title? -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 12:54, 18 November 2014 (UTC)
 
:::::::::...and what would you think about moving [[Core utilities#grep]] here? -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 12:57, 18 November 2014 (UTC)
 
:::::::::...and what would you think about moving [[Core utilities#grep]] here? -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 12:57, 18 November 2014 (UTC)
 +
 +
:::::::::: I agree the title ''File system search'' is less ambigious, as there were no other comments I've moved the page accordingly. -- [[User:Alad|Alad]] ([[User talk:Alad|talk]]) 00:27, 22 November 2014 (UTC)
 +
 
:::::::::: I'm against moving grep in here. Grep is such a general tool. Documentation for it could be in so many places. Maybe include a link to it or something. But i will think about this some more... :P [[User:Captaincurrie|Captaincurrie]] ([[User talk:Captaincurrie|talk]]) 10:02, 19 November 2014 (UTC)
 
:::::::::: I'm against moving grep in here. Grep is such a general tool. Documentation for it could be in so many places. Maybe include a link to it or something. But i will think about this some more... :P [[User:Captaincurrie|Captaincurrie]] ([[User talk:Captaincurrie|talk]]) 10:02, 19 November 2014 (UTC)
  

Revision as of 00:27, 22 November 2014

Move to upstream

Moved from Talk:Find. -- Alad (talk) 20:56, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Find is general tool. Not specific to Arch. Is there any upstream document location to move to? --Fengchao (talk) 07:56, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

Sure, but we have Core utilities already, plus several other tools have separate pages. Some users expressed wish to expand the selection of core utilities in the talk page, I remember that find was amongst them. -- Lahwaacz (talk) 17:34, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
It's also true that the web is full of find introductions and tutorials; one thing was mentioning it in Core utilities as was discussed, one other thing is having an entire article about it (kind of mirroring the man page), which I too find a bit exaggerated. Maybe there's a way to merge this page (after simplifying it) with locate and the list in List_of_applications#Desktop_search_engines into a unified article dedicated to file system searches? Such an article could be used to link to some good external tutorials. -- Kynikos (talk) 14:03, 14 November 2014 (UTC)
Merged Find, locate and List of applications#Desktop search engines to a new File search article. Initial import only, needs further work. -- Alad (talk) 20:57, 14 November 2014 (UTC) edit Alad (talk) 23:22, 14 November 2014 (UTC)
Thanks, however mine was just a rough idea, I think we could have waited to discuss it further :) For example, I think [1] left the parent section incomplete, I've reverted it for now. -- Kynikos (talk) 02:18, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
I don't like this 'Destop file search utilities' section. I think that should be on a seperate page for like 'GUI file search'. This is about the command line!Captaincurrie (talk) 19:51, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
I disagree, from the user's perspective it's the same task: there's 1. files, and 2. know where they are. Compare to List of applications - the separation between "command line" and "GUI" is subordinate to the task at hand. However, Category:Command shells may be removed from the article. -- Alad (talk) 20:19, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
There is a big difference between finding a file based on its name (find, locate) and based on its content (most/all of the tools in File search#Desktop search engines). The latter includes also some tools from List_of_applications#Email_clients (mu, notmuch etc.) and many more for other types of files. The connection between these two branches is that find can be combined with converters (e.g. pdftotext for pdf files) and grep-like tools via find's --exec option, allowing to develop a simple full-text search engine. Do we still want to describe this in one page? -- Lahwaacz (talk) 21:10, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
Well, I originally talked about "file system searches", maybe that would include searching in the content of files too, even specific databases that may be supported by such tools; this means the article should be renamed "File system search" or similar; perhaps we could merge also Core_Utilities#grep here?
On the other hand I wouldn't mind at all if the list of search engines was instead moved back to List of application, for simplicity: in that case maybe we could still leave find and locate together here instead of splitting them back to separate articles.
-- Kynikos (talk) 13:35, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
I think "Desktop Search Engines" is a good title for a seperate page. And we should probably consider alternative names for this page. "File Search" is not a very descriptive title for 'command line searching' Captaincurrie (talk) 13:38, 17 November 2014 (UTC)
Nah for sure that list shouldn't stay in a separate page, at most it should be moved back to List of applications. However I'm starting to like it here, because it also helps keep the article as a generic presentation of search tools, without going too much into details that are already covered upstream. Anybody else thinks that "File system search" is a better title? -- Kynikos (talk) 12:54, 18 November 2014 (UTC)
...and what would you think about moving Core utilities#grep here? -- Kynikos (talk) 12:57, 18 November 2014 (UTC)
I agree the title File system search is less ambigious, as there were no other comments I've moved the page accordingly. -- Alad (talk) 00:27, 22 November 2014 (UTC)
I'm against moving grep in here. Grep is such a general tool. Documentation for it could be in so many places. Maybe include a link to it or something. But i will think about this some more... :P Captaincurrie (talk) 10:02, 19 November 2014 (UTC)
I think find is a really difficult tool to master and requires a full page of good documentation. There are many tutorials on the web, but all the ones i've read, IMO, suck.
But maybe the Arch Wiki isn't the right place for this kind of documentation. I don't know. But i want to write this down somewhere... Captaincurrie (talk) 17:09, 14 November 2014 (UTC)
I see, but maybe the reason why "all" the other tutorials "suck" (just quoting you, this is subjective of course) is that they try to explain too much in details, duplicating the upstream documentation and ending up with confusing structures, which is something that could happen to this article too, since it would pursue the same goal after all. Perhaps what you can instead try here is write a simple introduction that serves as an orientation guide to [2], linking there for detailed information: this would be a different approach that could do well at helping beginners. -- Kynikos (talk) 02:18, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
I like that :). I think that is what i was going for from the beginning. I don't want to give a detailed description of every option. Just a 'philosophy' to help guide the mind to a proper use of this command. For me, that was the biggest barrier to learning how to use it. Captaincurrie (talk) 19:13, 15 November 2014 (UTC)

Should the fact that GNU find is being decribed be explicit throughout the entire article? —This unsigned comment is by Captaincurrie (talk) 15 November 2014. Please sign your posts with ~~~~!

What do you mean exactly? Note that currently the article is not only about GNU find, so don't write as if it was :) -- Kynikos (talk) 13:35, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

Examples were removed from this page. Does everyone agree on that? I think i do. Captaincurrie (talk) 10:02, 19 November 2014 (UTC)