Difference between revisions of "Talk:Table of contents"

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(Rename Category:Web Server to Category:Servers: re)
("also in" translations: re)
 
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:Maybe not so easily, since I'd need a dictionary of words that should be left lower-case. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 20:51, 15 June 2012 (UTC)
 
:Maybe not so easily, since I'd need a dictionary of words that should be left lower-case. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 20:51, 15 June 2012 (UTC)
  
=="also in" links==
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== "also in" translations ==
Do you like seeing the "also in" links next to categories that have more than one parent? -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] 06:56, 1 March 2012 (EST)
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Currently only Spanish, <s>French</s>, Italian and Portuguese have a translated "also in" string for categories with more than one parent, all the others are using the English wording. Please request new translations here. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] 05:59, 12 March 2012 (EDT)
:Related discussion: [[Help talk:Style#Category pages - tree or otherwise?]] If we return to a tree structure, "also in" links would not exist. -- [[User:Pointone|pointone]] 19:18, 13 March 2012 (EDT)
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<s>
::But maybe in that case displaying them would be even more important, as a means of detecting violations to the rule. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] 08:27, 14 March 2012 (EDT)
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:Please, add russian translation: '''Также в категории''' or simply '''Также в''' -- [[User:Kycok|Kycok]] ([[User talk:Kycok|talk]]) 11:48, 25 April 2014 (UTC)
:::Quite right. My vote is conditional upon the tree decision, then. If a tree structure is enforced, display it to detect violations. If we allow multiple categories, however, hide it to avoid clutter. -- [[User:Pointone|pointone]] 13:04, 15 March 2012 (EDT)
 
::::Ah kk your position is perfectly clear. However I wouldn't consider the ToC only as a tool for end-users, I think it's also very useful for maintainers, in fact being able to spot multi-parent categories (be them allowed or not) gives a clearer idea of how the articles are structured.
 
::::Some ideas to reduce/avoid clutter:
 
::::*[[:Category:Display managers|Display managers]] (8) <sup>also in [[:Category:Boot process|Boot process]], [[:Category:Daemons and system services|Daemons and system services]]</sup>
 
:::::(I'll probably implement this solution for the next update)
 
::::*[[:Category:Display managers|Display managers]] (8) <sup><span title="also in Boot process, Daemons and system services">*</span></sup>
 
:::::(for this option, place the mouse on the asterisk; we can use another symbol, like <sup>+  ^  #  !</sup>)
 
::::-- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] 07:06, 16 March 2012 (EDT)
 
::::The first idea is implemented currently with &lt;small>. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] 11:56, 18 March 2012 (EDT)
 
  
===Poll===
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::[https://github.com/kynikos/wiki-monkey/commit/82bcc4ab09ce0d2a7146a52f1aa254ea926d7c71 Done], the change will be visible after the next scheduled update of [[Table of Contents (Русский)]], this Sunday. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 14:05, 25 April 2014 (UTC)
;Display it
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</s>
:''[vote with {{ic|<nowiki>: ~~~~</nowiki>}}]''
 
: [[User:Thestinger|thestinger]] 00:48, 2 March 2012 (EST)
 
: [[User:Skydiver|Skydiver]] 00:51, 2 March 2012 (EST)
 
: [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] 05:09, 2 March 2012 (EST)
 
;Don't display it
 
:''[vote with {{ic|<nowiki>: ~~~~</nowiki>}}]''
 
: [[User:Fengchao|Fengchao]] 20:09, 1 March 2012 (EST)
 
: [[User:Pointone|pointone]] 19:18, 13 March 2012 (EDT)
 
  
=="also in" translations==
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:::I think it is not such hard to translate "also in" to ask native speakers to send it =). So I decided help you to localise bot.
Currently only Spanish, French, Italian and Portuguese have a translated "also in" string for categories with more than one parent, all the others are using the English wording. Please request new translations here. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] 05:59, 12 March 2012 (EDT)
 
  
== Add Table of Contents link into left navigation panel  ==
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ar:أيضا في
 +
bg:също в
 +
cs:také v
 +
da:også i
 +
de:auch in
 +
el:επίσης σε
 +
es:también en
 +
he:גם ב
 +
hr:također u
 +
hu:is
 +
id:juga di
 +
it:anche in
 +
ja:また、中
 +
ko:도에
 +
lt:taip pat ir
 +
nl:ook in
 +
pl:również
 +
pt:também em
 +
ru:также в
 +
sk:tiež v
 +
sr:такође у
 +
th:ยังอยู่ใน
 +
uk:також в
 +
zh-CN:?
 +
zh-TW:?
  
Sometime I want to visit this Table of Contents page. Right now I have to click to Main Page and then Click the link on the top.  Why not add a link into navigation part on left page. It will be more visiable their. -- [[User:Fengchao|Fengchao]] ([[User talk:Fengchao|talk]]) 04:14, 21 June 2012 (UTC)
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:::I am not sure about chinees languages, but I know still much languages, right =D? Google knows more. If somebody will dislike translation, then I think he/she will request better one. [[User:Agent0|Agent0]] ([[User_talk:Agent0|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Agent0|contribs]]) 11:25, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
  
:Actually this seems a pretty cool idea to me! It's as easy as editing [[MediaWiki:Sidebar]]: what about putting the link in second place, right below the link to [[Main Page]]? -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 09:50, 23 June 2012 (UTC)
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::::Thanks! I agree that this will encourage native speakers to provide the correct translation, I've [https://github.com/kynikos/wiki-monkey/commit/06d94865971713790a2f86ee0e8fa40d793a597f patched] the configuration. — [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 02:11, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
 +
::::: zh-CN:同时还属于. --[[User:Fengchao|Fengchao]] ([[User talk:Fengchao|talk]]) 12:13, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
  
:: That is my prefered location too. -- [[User:Fengchao|Fengchao]] ([[User talk:Fengchao|talk]]) 14:02, 24 June 2012 (UTC)
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::::::Thanks Fengchao, is it ok if there's a space between that and the category names?[https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=Table_of_Contents_%28%E7%AE%80%E4%BD%93%E4%B8%AD%E6%96%87%29&diff=prev&oldid=393212]  — [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 02:49, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
 +
::::::: Yes, the space is OK and more clear.--[[User:Fengchao|Fengchao]] ([[User talk:Fengchao|talk]]) 09:53, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
  
:::Sounds good! A possible alternative would be to include the ToC on the Main Page itself. -- [[User:Pointone|pointone]] ([[User talk:Pointone|talk]]) 15:04, 24 June 2012 (UTC)
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:If you are still doing this and still need one, you can add French '''aussi dans'''. Thanks! [[User:Modhaarn|Modhaarn]] ([[User talk:Modhaarn|talk]]) 23:21, 12 February 2016 (UTC)
  
::::For the moment I've added the link to the navigation pane (also for curiosity ^^ ), although I don't understand why our [[MediaWiki:Sidebar]] had been deleted (automatically with an update?) with a "No longer required" summary.
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::Hi, the French wiki is on a separate domain, http://wiki.archlinux.fr , therefore it doesn't use an automatic ToC like the languages on archlinux.org. — [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 01:30, 13 February 2016 (UTC)
::::The idea of reorganizing the [[Main Page]] however is kind of interesting, it would be worth discussing it separately :) Maybe instead of adding the whole ToC we could add only some major categories, or create a section with featured articles...
 
::::-- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 10:56, 25 June 2012 (UTC)
 
::::: Where to translate "Table of Contents" to other language ? I can not find it. -- [[User:Fengchao|Fengchao]] ([[User talk:Fengchao|talk]]) 02:11, 26 June 2012 (UTC)
 
::::::I'll see what can be done, thanks for the report. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 08:06, 26 June 2012 (UTC)
 
:::::::We'd probably need to create and translate a system message: [[Special:AllMessages]] says ''"This is a list of system messages available in the MediaWiki namespace. Please visit [[mw:Localisation|MediaWiki Localisation]] and [https://translatewiki.net/ translatewiki.net] if you wish to contribute to the generic MediaWiki localisation."''. I don't have a clear idea of what we should do now, there's still the alternative of adding the ToC to the main page. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 19:52, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 
:::::Currently there's a problem with the cache and the link to [[Table of Contents]] is visible only on a minority of pages: it should be visible when logged in, or by appending {{ic|1=?action=purge}} to the url when not logged in (see [[mw:Manual:Purge]]). I hope the cache will refresh automatically in the next days. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 08:02, 26 June 2012 (UTC)
 
::::::Apparently the cache doesn't refresh this feature, instead it refreshes it only as the pages are edited and saved (or just purged as shown above). -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 19:52, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 
  
== Rename [[:Category:Web Server]] to [[:Category:Servers]] ==
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== Place two lists side by side ==
  
Moved from [[Talk:Fengchao]]:
+
What about idea of placing list of categories side by side in non english articles? In that case order of translated titles will be exactly matching with english titles. For non existing translated categories we can just make a blank cell. For example there is no russian category classroom and so numbering is going out of sync with english toc. But with table it will be like this:
I noticed you moved the sendmail article to the "web server" category. But is that correct? It does not use or require apache, or lighthttp or any other web server.  
+
{| class="wikitable"
And this is not an article about squirrelmail or any other webmail package. (It can work with squirrelmail and others, and I do plan to add a link to the current  squirrelmail article, and including config tips for sendmail on the squirrelmail article, but squirrelmail is not the point of the sendmail article)
+
|+ Table of categories
I did look for a category called "mail server" or something, but since there isn't any, I came to the conclusion that Networking was the closest correct thing.
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! Number !! English !! Russian
 
+
|-
Hmm, may I suggest a "mail servers" category? It could hold not only this article, but also the one about Postfix, Exim, Courier MTA, etc.
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| 1.3 || Arch Wiki (26) || Arch Wiki (Russian) (17)
We currently have a "email clients" category. [[User:Chrisl|Chrisl]] ([[User talk:Chrisl|talk]]) 15:22, 22 August 2012 (UTC)
+
|-
: +1 on creating a new category. Thanks Chris for your work :) --[[User:Maevius|Maevius]] ([[User talk:Maevius|talk]]) 15:53, 22 August 2012 (UTC)
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| 1.4 || Classroom (14) ||
:: :D hehe thanks! [[User:Chrisl|Chrisl]] ([[User talk:Chrisl|talk]]) 03:19, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
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|-
::: +1 for a new category. Currently there are too many pages in [[:Category:Networking]]. Right now I am moving "Server" related article into [[:Category:Web Server]]. Clean up [[:Category:Web Server]] is next step in my Todo list. -- [[User:Fengchao|Fengchao]] ([[User talk:Fengchao|talk]]) 06:46, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
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| 1.5 || Events (3) || Events (Russian) (1)
:::: At the same time, the introduction in [[:Category:Web Server]] says:
+
|}
:::: ''This category contains articles on various types of servers: web page servers, mail servers, code repository servers.''
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And also it will be visually understandable how many articles are in corresponding english category and how many in translated. [[User:Agent0|Agent0]] ([[User_talk:Agent0|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Agent0|contribs]]) 11:50, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
:::: Should we change the category name to [[:Category:Servers]] to make it less confusion? And then we can add sub category for different servers.  
 
:::: -- [[User:Fengchao|Fengchao]] ([[User talk:Fengchao|talk]]) 07:15, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 
:::::IMHO [[:Category:Servers]] is too generic, servers can be many different kinds of software, not necessarily related to networking, think e.g. of Xorg.
 
:::::Since [[:Category:Internet Applications]] has already [[:Category:Email Client]], [[:Category:Web Browser]] and [[:Category:Web Server]], I guess creating [[:Category:Mail Server]] would be the most logic way to go. If however [[:Category:Mail Server]] would end up having too few articles, they should probably better categorized directly under [[:Category:Internet Applications]], since it's indeed true that a "mail" server is not a "web" (http/ftp) server.
 
:::::-- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 16:34, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 

Latest revision as of 01:31, 13 February 2016

i18n standardization

Non-English categories should follow the naming scheme Title in English (Language). See Help:i18n for details. Template:i18n should be included on all category pages. Furthermore, all category titles should be appropriately capitalized (Like a Title).

Are there any objections? I will prepare an outline of my imagined category tree shortly.

-- pointone 20:20, 10 May 2011 (EDT)

How about using native category names with redirects to i18n named categories on category pages? --AlexanderR (talk)
Actually I was thinking to propose the liberalization of titles for all pages (not only categories), but only after implementing Help_talk:I18n#.22Dummy.22_interlanguage_links_and_deprecation_of_Template:i18n. Please, until then let's stick with the current standard: we'll discuss this thing after that, there's already lots of stuff going on in that talk page :) -- Kynikos (talk) 20:30, 8 June 2012 (UTC)
Done. Thank you for pointing to Help_talk:I18n. Good luck with i18n work! --AlexanderR (talk)

Capitalization

[split from a previous discussion, now closed. -- Kynikos 16:48, 23 April 2012 (EDT)]

As I began sorting and standardizing the Spanish categories, I realized that many English categories have improper capitalization. These issues could probably more efficiently be dealt with simultaneously. --Emiralle 21:46, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

I can easily solve this one with my bot, although it's not urgent. -- Kynikos 16:48, 23 April 2012 (EDT)
Maybe not so easily, since I'd need a dictionary of words that should be left lower-case. -- Kynikos (talk) 20:51, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

"also in" translations

Currently only Spanish, French, Italian and Portuguese have a translated "also in" string for categories with more than one parent, all the others are using the English wording. Please request new translations here. -- Kynikos 05:59, 12 March 2012 (EDT)

Please, add russian translation: Также в категории or simply Также в -- Kycok (talk) 11:48, 25 April 2014 (UTC)
Done, the change will be visible after the next scheduled update of Table of Contents (Русский), this Sunday. -- Kynikos (talk) 14:05, 25 April 2014 (UTC)

I think it is not such hard to translate "also in" to ask native speakers to send it =). So I decided help you to localise bot.
ar:أيضا في
bg:също в
cs:také v
da:også i
de:auch in
el:επίσης σε
es:también en
he:גם ב
hr:također u
hu:is
id:juga di
it:anche in
ja:また、中
ko:도에
lt:taip pat ir
nl:ook in
pl:również
pt:também em
ru:также в
sk:tiež v
sr:такође у
th:ยังอยู่ใน
uk:також в
zh-CN:?
zh-TW:?
I am not sure about chinees languages, but I know still much languages, right =D? Google knows more. If somebody will dislike translation, then I think he/she will request better one. — Agent0 (talk|contribs) 11:25, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks! I agree that this will encourage native speakers to provide the correct translation, I've patched the configuration. — Kynikos (talk) 02:11, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
zh-CN:同时还属于. --Fengchao (talk) 12:13, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks Fengchao, is it ok if there's a space between that and the category names?[1]Kynikos (talk) 02:49, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
Yes, the space is OK and more clear.--Fengchao (talk) 09:53, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
If you are still doing this and still need one, you can add French aussi dans. Thanks! Modhaarn (talk) 23:21, 12 February 2016 (UTC)
Hi, the French wiki is on a separate domain, http://wiki.archlinux.fr , therefore it doesn't use an automatic ToC like the languages on archlinux.org. — Kynikos (talk) 01:30, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Place two lists side by side

What about idea of placing list of categories side by side in non english articles? In that case order of translated titles will be exactly matching with english titles. For non existing translated categories we can just make a blank cell. For example there is no russian category classroom and so numbering is going out of sync with english toc. But with table it will be like this:

Table of categories
Number English Russian
1.3 Arch Wiki (26) Arch Wiki (Russian) (17)
1.4 Classroom (14)
1.5 Events (3) Events (Russian) (1)

And also it will be visually understandable how many articles are in corresponding english category and how many in translated. — Agent0 (talk|contribs) 11:50, 17 August 2015 (UTC)