Difference between revisions of "User talk:Lahwaacz"

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Please stop editing the WPA Supplicant articleYou are ruining the structure and dragging it down to its former messy state with overly verbose and repetitive instruction. [[User:Earnest|Earnest]] ([[User talk:Earnest|talk]]) 15:06, 12 October 2013 (UTC)
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== Regex for replacing = codes ==
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 +
Hi, regarding [[User:Lahwaacz#User:Lahwaacz#Regex_for_replacing_.3D_codes]] do you intend to use a similar expression with the editor assistant or directly with the bot? In the latter case I think it would be pretty dangerous, for example it would break templates that already use a named parameter, e.g. {{ic|<nowiki>{{Template|parameter=value}}</nowiki>}} would be turned into {{ic|<nowiki>{{Template|1=parameter=value}}</nowiki>}}. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 16:57, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
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 +
:I used it [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=Systemd-networkd&diff=prev&oldid=306182 only once] and don't have any specific plans, but I'm quite certain I will need to use it again sometimes... Thanks for the warning, I will be cautious. -- [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 17:50, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
== PodCastXDL ==
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 +
About [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=List_of_applications/Internet&diff=prev&oldid=323048] (and [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=List_of_applications/Internet&diff=next&oldid=323048]) [[User:Levi0x0x]], who should have indeed provided an edit summary, appears to be the developer of the application and the maintainer of the PKGBUILD. I would keep his edit. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 00:45, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
:I know - I've seen also [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=MPlayer&diff=next&oldid=322278 bash-player] removed, both from wiki and Github (it seems the repo has been recreated from scratch). PodCastXDL has always been available upstream. -- [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 08:20, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
::Didn't he add it to the list one week ago? [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=List_of_applications/Internet&diff=prev&oldid=322258] Maybe he's found some bug and doesn't want people to use it until he fixes it? Anyway I'm not that interested, we can as well see if/how Levi0x0x reacts. -- [[User:Kynikos|Kynikos]] ([[User talk:Kynikos|talk]]) 04:32, 6 July 2014 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
== bot AUR to Official Repository edit ==
 +
 
 +
A recent bot edit ([https://github.com/lahwaacz/wiki-scripts/blob/master/update-package-templates.py update Pkg/AUR templates]) by [[User:Lahwaacz.bot]] on the [[Gitolite]] page correctly changed the AUR template to Pkg but left the [[Arch User Repository]] link
 +
 
 +
I fixed this, but would it be possible to modify the bot to take this into consideration?
 +
 
 +
I can imagine that blanket changing AUR links to Official Repository links in any given page could be dangerous - but for common phrasing or possibly word distance it would seem to be relatively safe
 +
 
 +
Or is there some sort of post-run manual inspection that I am unaware of that handles this situation?
 +
 
 +
Specifically this [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=Gitolite&diff=next&oldid=366859 edit]
 +
 
 +
From:
 +
<pre>
 +
{{AUR|gitolite}} is available in the [[Arch User Repository]]
 +
</pre>
 +
 
 +
To:
 +
<pre>
 +
{{Pkg|gitolite}} is available in the [[Arch User Repository]]
 +
</pre>
 +
 
 +
 
 +
 
 +
[[User:Tido.com|Tido.com]] ([[User talk:Tido.com|talk]]) 01:50, 1 April 2015 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
By "word distance" above what I _meant_ was [[Wikipedia:Edit Distance|Edit Distance]] ;)
 +
 
 +
I was initially thinking of Hamming distance - but apparently that is for strings of equal length.
 +
 
 +
What looks more promising is the Levenshtein distance - specifically "Comparing a list of strings" from the Python [https://pypi.python.org/pypi/Distance/0.1.3 Distance] package.
 +
 
 +
Example shamelessly ripped from that page:
 +
 
 +
(mainly because I couldn't link directly to the relevant section)
 +
 
 +
<pre>
 +
>>> sent1 = ['the', 'quick', 'brown', 'fox', 'jumps', 'over', 'the', 'lazy', 'dog']
 +
>>> sent2 = ['the', 'lazy', 'fox', 'jumps', 'over', 'the', 'crazy', 'dog']
 +
>>> distance.levenshtein(sent1, sent2)
 +
3
 +
</pre>
 +
[[User:Tido.com|Tido.com]] ([[User talk:Tido.com|talk]]) 04:07, 1 April 2015 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
:Hi,
 +
:the bot currently does not touch the surrounding text at all, it only modifies the package templates or appends [[Template:Broken package link]] when the package is not found. This is obviously not perfect, this behaviour may lead to some incorrect combinations as you noticed, but blindly fixing the package links and not the surrounding text is still considered to be an improvement. Checking the surrounding text manually would require a lot of manpower, which we don't have, so it is currently not done systematically. Feel free to ask for further details or see the most recent discussion: [[ArchWiki:Requests#Strategy_for_updating_package_templates]].
 +
:Regarding automatic updates of the surrounding text, the edit distance gives a clue about whether given edit should be performed or not, but it does not define how an edit should be performed. It can be useful in cases where there are multiple feasible substitutions in text and the strategy to select the optimal substitution is e.g. to minimize the Levenshtein distance. But we don't have any algorithm to generate feasible substitutions yet, so this technique fails. The surrounding text substitution is also very context sensitive and wiki bots must be designed in a way to minimize (ideally avoid completely) the [[wikipedia:Error_of_the_first_kind|error of the first kind]], which in this case is modifying correct text to be incorrect. This makes defining general rules for the text substitution really hard, on the other hand many rules would be necessary to cover even the basic form of standard wording, so in the end both ways may be comparably hard. Anyway, if you have some ideas, I'm all ears :)
 +
:-- [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 17:51, 1 April 2015 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
== bot checking links after move ==
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 +
Hi, re [[Talk:Touchpad Synaptics#adding libinput alternative]]. [[Touchpad Synaptics]] has 100+ backlinks and the more important ones -  a bit tedious task. I was just glancing over your clever github bot scripts. It would be handy to have a script after such moves: walk over the backlinks of [[Touchpad Synaptics]] and just replace "[[Touchpad Synaptics" with "[[Synaptics" from the links. That would leave all links to subsections intact. Leaving out the translations to handle manually, there would not be much to go wrong, or? --[[User:Indigo|Indigo]] ([[User talk:Indigo|talk]]) 07:36, 26 September 2015 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
:Hi, thanks for the suggestion. It would be indeed handy in this case, but most likely not generally. Imagine that there was a [[UUID]] page, which was later generalized and renamed to [[Persistent block device naming]] and content about UUID is now only a section on the page. In this case using the naive replacement would likely change the meaning of many sentences, and using shorter redirects for convenience is actually encouraged. There would have to be a list of whitelisted "harmless" replacements, which could even help to replace <nowiki>[[pacman|Install]]</nowiki> with <nowiki>[[Install]]</nowiki> etc. -- [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 08:01, 26 September 2015 (UTC)
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 +
::Yes, good examples, but you are thinking universal already :) I did not mean it could be that. For example, if you take the time when the bulk of the title case moves were done. With such a script one could avoid a lot of internal redirects as well. E.g. [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Special:WhatLinksHere/Beginners'_Guide]. But it's ok, just an idea. Please close this, if you think it's too singular cases with a simple enough replacement where it could be applied. --[[User:Indigo|Indigo]] ([[User talk:Indigo|talk]]) 10:02, 26 September 2015 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
== <s>link checker bot</s> ==
 +
 
 +
Hi,
 +
curiously the external link used in [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=Official_repositories&curid=2716&diff=427897&oldid=425879] works. I tried the following in firefox and gnome-web:
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* [//kernel.org]
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* [//kernel.org kernel.org]
 +
* [//sourceforge.net sourceforge.net]
 +
* [//bugs.freedesktop.org freedesktop]
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* [//nytimes.com nytimes_nossl]
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* [//libvirt.org this link destination has ssl and nonssl too]
 +
 
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All work fine, i.e. default to ssl when possible.
 +
Neat, uh? Maybe something to add to style and use your bot for? What do you think? --[[User:Indigo|Indigo]] ([[User talk:Indigo|talk]]) 12:10, 26 March 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
:It's a ''protocol-relative'' link (see e.g. [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Links#External_links]), so the scheme is taken from the current URL, there is no fallback if the selected scheme does not work. For example [//mmg.fjfi.cvut.cz/mmg/index.php this link] does not work if you read this using HTTPS, because the target page is only available via HTTP.
 +
:As for the style guidelines, I would actually prefer explicit schemes (using HTTPS wherever possible). Is the Arch wiki even available via HTTP?
 +
:-- [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 12:54, 26 March 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
::Yeah, ok. Thanks for the links. I thought at first, some wm magic figures ssl availability in the background first. Since that does not work, any style rule to shorten out https:// is not useful (/makes it too complicated), I agree.
 +
::As for the wiki, no, the nginx redirects everytime. So a simple {{ic|curl http://wiki.archlinux.org}} fails flat. But I see they moved luna's certificate to Let's encrypt. One neat thing :) Closing. --[[User:Indigo|Indigo]] ([[User talk:Indigo|talk]]) 13:30, 26 March 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
== AMDGPU license edit ==
 +
 
 +
Hi Lahwaacz,
 +
 
 +
Regarding [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=AMDGPU&diff=436532&oldid=435838 this edit]: why should be mentioned explicitly?
 +
There is almost no mention of licenses in the wiki at all, so I'm curious why you would like to have it mentioned in this specific case.
 +
 
 +
If I recall correctly, there is nothing about this in the style guide or similar (which is a good thing IMO).
 +
I would think it this is something that should be mentioned in the PKGBUILD ([[Arch packaging standards#Licenses]]).
 +
 
 +
Thanks! [[User:Lonaowna|Lonaowna]] ([[User talk:Lonaowna|talk]]) 19:21, 30 May 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
:Well, the thing is that the license is not mentioned in the PKGBUILD either. As far as I know, the AMDGPU-PRO driver is proprietary, so at least the word "proprietary" should be mentioned, because describing it along with the open-source AMDGPU driver on the same page is not very clear. -- [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 19:41, 30 May 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
::Ah sorry, I didn't notice you had already notified the package maintainer.
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::I guess he should include [http://support.amd.com/en-us/download/eula this EULA] which is linked at the download page. In the meantime, it remains a case of "documenting AUR package bugs", which is always a bit questionable.
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::And I have [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=AMDGPU&diff=436762&oldid=436532 added] the word "proprietary" since you are right that that should be mentioned. ;)
 +
::--[[User:Lonaowna|Lonaowna]] ([[User talk:Lonaowna|talk]]) 20:18, 30 May 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
:::Thanks [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 20:25, 30 May 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
== Parallel ports ==
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 +
About [https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php?title=Users_and_groups&diff=next&oldid=437364 this]: How am I supposed to read from or write to my parallel port without being a member of lp? Both {{ic|/dev/lp0}} and {{ic|/dev/parport0}} are owned by root:lp. [[User:Alex Henrie|Alex Henrie]] ([[User talk:Alex Henrie|talk]]) 16:17, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
This isn't a theoretical question. Here's what happens when I try:
 +
 
 +
$ ls -l /dev/lp0   
 +
crw-rw---- 1 root lp 6, 0 Jun  5 10:32 /dev/lp0
 +
$ ls -l /dev/parport0
 +
crw-rw-r-- 1 root lp 99, 0 Jun  5 10:32 /dev/parport0
 +
$ echo "Hello world!" > /dev/lp0
 +
bash: /dev/lp0: Permission denied
 +
$ echo "Hello world!" > /dev/parport0
 +
bash: /dev/parport0: Permission denied
 +
 
 +
These commands were run from an LXTerminal. Systemd, D-BUS, and LXDE all started normally. [[User:Alex Henrie|Alex Henrie]] ([[User talk:Alex Henrie|talk]]) 16:35, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
:That's the same state as with any USB printer. I admit that I don't have a parallel printer to tinker with, so could you enlighten me how you make use of the printer? If it's [[CUPS]], note that {{ic|cupsd}} runs as root so it will have access to the printer. -- [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 19:40, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
::I'm not using a printer. I'm using a different device connected to a parallel port. [[User:Alex Henrie|Alex Henrie]] ([[User talk:Alex Henrie|talk]]) 19:47, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
:::OK, no idea who had the great idea that all parallel ports will get the {{ic|lp}} group belonging to printers... You can override the default with a custom [[udev]] rule, but are {{ic|/dev/lp0}} and {{ic|/dev/parport0}} really the same device? From the output above it does not seem to be a symlink so they should be different devices.
 +
:::For starters, I think that something like this should work:
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{{hc|/etc/udev/rules.d/99-parport.rules|2=
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ACTION=="add", KERNEL=="parport[0-9]*", GROUP="''group_name''"
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}}
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:::Pick some {{ic|''group_name''}} better than {{ic|lp}}.
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:::-- [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 20:19, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
::::A physical parallel port can expose multiple virtual parallel ports. {{ic|/dev/lp0}} is the physical parallel port, and {{ic|/dev/parport0}} is the virtual parallel port. Please read the first two sections of "The Linux 2.4 Parallel Port Subsystem" by Tim Waugh: [https://people.redhat.com/twaugh/parport/html/design.html#AEN19] [https://people.redhat.com/twaugh/parport/html/x36.html]
 +
::::As long as systemd assigns all parallel ports to {{ic|lp}} by default, regardless of the type of device connected to it, I don't think we can call this group deprecated. [[User:Alex Henrie|Alex Henrie]] ([[User talk:Alex Henrie|talk]]) 20:52, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
:::::I've been wondering about those groups as well before. Reading up on it now, I think the [[Users and groups#Pre-systemd groups]] list is misleading. References: 1. For CUPS [http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/view/cvs/pst/cups.html #Installation of Cups] section names {{ic|lp}} explicitly and that conforms with [[CUPS/Troubleshooting#Explanation of the GID issue]]. 2. [https://lists.archlinux.org/pipermail/arch-general/2012-October/031808.html tomgun] explains an example for {{ic|scanner}} group, 3. and [https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?pid=1183467#p1183467 Mr. Elendig] sums up my current conclusion perfectly: The groups are not deprecated (maybe some but not {{ic|lp}}) - what is deprecated is to add the user to them, because that part is handled by systemd/udev.
 +
:::::Can that be the case?
 +
:::::--[[User:Indigo|Indigo]] ([[User talk:Indigo|talk]]) 21:39, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
 +
 
 +
::::::So there is an additional translation layer between {{ic|/dev/lp0}} and {{ic|/dev/parport0}}. But as per [https://people.redhat.com/twaugh/parport/html/lp.html], the "{{ic|lp}} is a {{ic|parport}} client". Since you're not operating a printer, I assume you're not interested in using the [https://people.redhat.com/twaugh/parport/html/ppdev.html "printer protocol"] via {{ic|/dev/lp0}}. Then since {{ic|/dev/lp0}} and {{ic|/dev/parport0}} are two different files, there is no reason they should have the same GID. Using the {{ic|lp}} group for all {{ic|parport[0-9]*}} devices, which are (almost?) never used to access printers, really is confusing. Maybe not so much until CUPS was invented, but since they chose to abuse the {{ic|lp}} group as the default group for their control files, users operating any parport device will automatically get access to CUPS. -- [[User:Lahwaacz|Lahwaacz]] ([[User talk:Lahwaacz|talk]]) 07:24, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 07:24, 6 June 2016

Regex for replacing = codes

Hi, regarding User:Lahwaacz#User:Lahwaacz#Regex_for_replacing_.3D_codes do you intend to use a similar expression with the editor assistant or directly with the bot? In the latter case I think it would be pretty dangerous, for example it would break templates that already use a named parameter, e.g. {{Template|parameter=value}} would be turned into {{Template|1=parameter=value}}. -- Kynikos (talk) 16:57, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

I used it only once and don't have any specific plans, but I'm quite certain I will need to use it again sometimes... Thanks for the warning, I will be cautious. -- Lahwaacz (talk) 17:50, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

PodCastXDL

About [1] (and [2]) User:Levi0x0x, who should have indeed provided an edit summary, appears to be the developer of the application and the maintainer of the PKGBUILD. I would keep his edit. -- Kynikos (talk) 00:45, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

I know - I've seen also bash-player removed, both from wiki and Github (it seems the repo has been recreated from scratch). PodCastXDL has always been available upstream. -- Lahwaacz (talk) 08:20, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
Didn't he add it to the list one week ago? [3] Maybe he's found some bug and doesn't want people to use it until he fixes it? Anyway I'm not that interested, we can as well see if/how Levi0x0x reacts. -- Kynikos (talk) 04:32, 6 July 2014 (UTC)

bot AUR to Official Repository edit

A recent bot edit (update Pkg/AUR templates) by User:Lahwaacz.bot on the Gitolite page correctly changed the AUR template to Pkg but left the Arch User Repository link

I fixed this, but would it be possible to modify the bot to take this into consideration?

I can imagine that blanket changing AUR links to Official Repository links in any given page could be dangerous - but for common phrasing or possibly word distance it would seem to be relatively safe

Or is there some sort of post-run manual inspection that I am unaware of that handles this situation?

Specifically this edit

From:

{{AUR|gitolite}} is available in the [[Arch User Repository]]

To:

{{Pkg|gitolite}} is available in the [[Arch User Repository]]


Tido.com (talk) 01:50, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

By "word distance" above what I _meant_ was Edit Distance ;)

I was initially thinking of Hamming distance - but apparently that is for strings of equal length.

What looks more promising is the Levenshtein distance - specifically "Comparing a list of strings" from the Python Distance package.

Example shamelessly ripped from that page:

(mainly because I couldn't link directly to the relevant section)

>>> sent1 = ['the', 'quick', 'brown', 'fox', 'jumps', 'over', 'the', 'lazy', 'dog']
>>> sent2 = ['the', 'lazy', 'fox', 'jumps', 'over', 'the', 'crazy', 'dog']
>>> distance.levenshtein(sent1, sent2)
3

Tido.com (talk) 04:07, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Hi,
the bot currently does not touch the surrounding text at all, it only modifies the package templates or appends Template:Broken package link when the package is not found. This is obviously not perfect, this behaviour may lead to some incorrect combinations as you noticed, but blindly fixing the package links and not the surrounding text is still considered to be an improvement. Checking the surrounding text manually would require a lot of manpower, which we don't have, so it is currently not done systematically. Feel free to ask for further details or see the most recent discussion: ArchWiki:Requests#Strategy_for_updating_package_templates.
Regarding automatic updates of the surrounding text, the edit distance gives a clue about whether given edit should be performed or not, but it does not define how an edit should be performed. It can be useful in cases where there are multiple feasible substitutions in text and the strategy to select the optimal substitution is e.g. to minimize the Levenshtein distance. But we don't have any algorithm to generate feasible substitutions yet, so this technique fails. The surrounding text substitution is also very context sensitive and wiki bots must be designed in a way to minimize (ideally avoid completely) the error of the first kind, which in this case is modifying correct text to be incorrect. This makes defining general rules for the text substitution really hard, on the other hand many rules would be necessary to cover even the basic form of standard wording, so in the end both ways may be comparably hard. Anyway, if you have some ideas, I'm all ears :)
-- Lahwaacz (talk) 17:51, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

bot checking links after move

Hi, re Talk:Touchpad Synaptics#adding libinput alternative. Touchpad Synaptics has 100+ backlinks and the more important ones - a bit tedious task. I was just glancing over your clever github bot scripts. It would be handy to have a script after such moves: walk over the backlinks of Touchpad Synaptics and just replace "[[Touchpad Synaptics" with "[[Synaptics" from the links. That would leave all links to subsections intact. Leaving out the translations to handle manually, there would not be much to go wrong, or? --Indigo (talk) 07:36, 26 September 2015 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for the suggestion. It would be indeed handy in this case, but most likely not generally. Imagine that there was a UUID page, which was later generalized and renamed to Persistent block device naming and content about UUID is now only a section on the page. In this case using the naive replacement would likely change the meaning of many sentences, and using shorter redirects for convenience is actually encouraged. There would have to be a list of whitelisted "harmless" replacements, which could even help to replace [[pacman|Install]] with [[Install]] etc. -- Lahwaacz (talk) 08:01, 26 September 2015 (UTC)
Yes, good examples, but you are thinking universal already :) I did not mean it could be that. For example, if you take the time when the bulk of the title case moves were done. With such a script one could avoid a lot of internal redirects as well. E.g. [4]. But it's ok, just an idea. Please close this, if you think it's too singular cases with a simple enough replacement where it could be applied. --Indigo (talk) 10:02, 26 September 2015 (UTC)

link checker bot

Hi, curiously the external link used in [5] works. I tried the following in firefox and gnome-web:

All work fine, i.e. default to ssl when possible. Neat, uh? Maybe something to add to style and use your bot for? What do you think? --Indigo (talk) 12:10, 26 March 2016 (UTC)

It's a protocol-relative link (see e.g. [7]), so the scheme is taken from the current URL, there is no fallback if the selected scheme does not work. For example this link does not work if you read this using HTTPS, because the target page is only available via HTTP.
As for the style guidelines, I would actually prefer explicit schemes (using HTTPS wherever possible). Is the Arch wiki even available via HTTP?
-- Lahwaacz (talk) 12:54, 26 March 2016 (UTC)
Yeah, ok. Thanks for the links. I thought at first, some wm magic figures ssl availability in the background first. Since that does not work, any style rule to shorten out https:// is not useful (/makes it too complicated), I agree.
As for the wiki, no, the nginx redirects everytime. So a simple curl http://wiki.archlinux.org fails flat. But I see they moved luna's certificate to Let's encrypt. One neat thing :) Closing. --Indigo (talk) 13:30, 26 March 2016 (UTC)

AMDGPU license edit

Hi Lahwaacz,

Regarding this edit: why should be mentioned explicitly? There is almost no mention of licenses in the wiki at all, so I'm curious why you would like to have it mentioned in this specific case.

If I recall correctly, there is nothing about this in the style guide or similar (which is a good thing IMO). I would think it this is something that should be mentioned in the PKGBUILD (Arch packaging standards#Licenses).

Thanks! Lonaowna (talk) 19:21, 30 May 2016 (UTC)

Well, the thing is that the license is not mentioned in the PKGBUILD either. As far as I know, the AMDGPU-PRO driver is proprietary, so at least the word "proprietary" should be mentioned, because describing it along with the open-source AMDGPU driver on the same page is not very clear. -- Lahwaacz (talk) 19:41, 30 May 2016 (UTC)
Ah sorry, I didn't notice you had already notified the package maintainer.
I guess he should include this EULA which is linked at the download page. In the meantime, it remains a case of "documenting AUR package bugs", which is always a bit questionable.
And I have added the word "proprietary" since you are right that that should be mentioned. ;)
--Lonaowna (talk) 20:18, 30 May 2016 (UTC)
Thanks Lahwaacz (talk) 20:25, 30 May 2016 (UTC)

Parallel ports

About this: How am I supposed to read from or write to my parallel port without being a member of lp? Both /dev/lp0 and /dev/parport0 are owned by root:lp. Alex Henrie (talk) 16:17, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

This isn't a theoretical question. Here's what happens when I try:

$ ls -l /dev/lp0     
crw-rw---- 1 root lp 6, 0 Jun  5 10:32 /dev/lp0
$ ls -l /dev/parport0
crw-rw-r-- 1 root lp 99, 0 Jun  5 10:32 /dev/parport0
$ echo "Hello world!" > /dev/lp0
bash: /dev/lp0: Permission denied
$ echo "Hello world!" > /dev/parport0
bash: /dev/parport0: Permission denied

These commands were run from an LXTerminal. Systemd, D-BUS, and LXDE all started normally. Alex Henrie (talk) 16:35, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

That's the same state as with any USB printer. I admit that I don't have a parallel printer to tinker with, so could you enlighten me how you make use of the printer? If it's CUPS, note that cupsd runs as root so it will have access to the printer. -- Lahwaacz (talk) 19:40, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
I'm not using a printer. I'm using a different device connected to a parallel port. Alex Henrie (talk) 19:47, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
OK, no idea who had the great idea that all parallel ports will get the lp group belonging to printers... You can override the default with a custom udev rule, but are /dev/lp0 and /dev/parport0 really the same device? From the output above it does not seem to be a symlink so they should be different devices.
For starters, I think that something like this should work:
/etc/udev/rules.d/99-parport.rules
ACTION=="add", KERNEL=="parport[0-9]*", GROUP="group_name"
Pick some group_name better than lp.
-- Lahwaacz (talk) 20:19, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
A physical parallel port can expose multiple virtual parallel ports. /dev/lp0 is the physical parallel port, and /dev/parport0 is the virtual parallel port. Please read the first two sections of "The Linux 2.4 Parallel Port Subsystem" by Tim Waugh: [8] [9]
As long as systemd assigns all parallel ports to lp by default, regardless of the type of device connected to it, I don't think we can call this group deprecated. Alex Henrie (talk) 20:52, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
I've been wondering about those groups as well before. Reading up on it now, I think the Users and groups#Pre-systemd groups list is misleading. References: 1. For CUPS #Installation of Cups section names lp explicitly and that conforms with CUPS/Troubleshooting#Explanation of the GID issue. 2. tomgun explains an example for scanner group, 3. and Mr. Elendig sums up my current conclusion perfectly: The groups are not deprecated (maybe some but not lp) - what is deprecated is to add the user to them, because that part is handled by systemd/udev.
Can that be the case?
--Indigo (talk) 21:39, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
So there is an additional translation layer between /dev/lp0 and /dev/parport0. But as per [10], the "lp is a parport client". Since you're not operating a printer, I assume you're not interested in using the "printer protocol" via /dev/lp0. Then since /dev/lp0 and /dev/parport0 are two different files, there is no reason they should have the same GID. Using the lp group for all parport[0-9]* devices, which are (almost?) never used to access printers, really is confusing. Maybe not so much until CUPS was invented, but since they chose to abuse the lp group as the default group for their control files, users operating any parport device will automatically get access to CUPS. -- Lahwaacz (talk) 07:24, 6 June 2016 (UTC)